Skip to main content
Loading…

Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

Criathragan Hide all filters

Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 8 April 2026
  7. Session 6: 13 May 2021 to 8 April 2026
Select which types of business to include


Select level of detail in results

Displaying 4079 contributions

|

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Performance Framework

Meeting date: 21 September 2021

The Convener

Under item 2, we will take evidence on the national performance framework. We are joined by John Swinney, the Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Covid Recovery, who is no stranger to the finance committee, having attended myriad meetings of our predecessor committees over many years. He is accompanied by his officials from the Scottish Government: Barry Stalker, the head of the national performance framework unit; and Tim Ellis, the deputy director of the performance and outcomes division. I welcome our witnesses to the meeting.

Members have received a briefing paper from the clerks. I intend to allow up to 90 minutes for the session. Before we move to questions from the committee, I invite Mr Swinney to make a short opening statement, should he wish to do so.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Performance Framework

Meeting date: 21 September 2021

The Convener

Well done, cabinet secretary, you have responded to more than 30 questions from the committee. However, we are still within time, so I will ask some short questions to finish off.

Audit Scotland has said that there are inherent challenges in delivering an outcome-based approach. For example, Audit Scotland states:

“It is difficult to separate out what impact public services have on outcomes, as many factors are outside the direct control of the public sector.”

Audit Scotland says that effective joined-up working, early planning and an understanding of the evidence and its gaps could all help to resolve the issue. How can those gaps be closed so that we have a much fairer picture?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Performance Framework

Meeting date: 21 September 2021

The Convener

How do you weigh the NPF relative to other areas? If indicators are worsening, improving or maintaining their position—whatever it happens to be—how do you decide that additional resource might have to be shifted from A to B to address matters?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Interests

Meeting date: 21 September 2021

The Convener (Kenneth Gibson)

Good morning, and welcome to the fifth meeting in 2021 of the Finance and Public Administration Committee. We have received apologies from Liz Smith, so Tess White is attending as her substitute for the Conservatives. I welcome Tess to the meeting. As this is the first time that she has joined us, I invite her to declare any relevant interests.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2022-23: Public Finances and the Impact of Covid-19

Meeting date: 14 September 2021

The Convener

Culture change is always a difficult challenge.

This will be my final question, as I want to let colleagues in. Ray Perman, you say in your submission:

“The RSE is concerned that new initiatives from the UK Government, including the Shared Prosperity Fund, Levelling Up Fund, and Community Renewal Fund will bypass the devolved administrations.”

Can you elaborate on those concerns?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2022-23: Public Finances and the Impact of Covid-19

Meeting date: 14 September 2021

The Convener

I will move on to something that we have discussed. I am looking to find out from Gail Macgregor where the balance should be struck on local flexibility. In 2007 the Scottish Government abolished some 60 ring-fenced funds from the previous Labour-Lib Dem Administration and signed what is now fondly looked back on as the historic concordat of November 2007. The idea was that local flexibility would be restored across local government.

However, an issue arose, of course, for the Scottish ministers when they allocated funding for specific pots—for teacher numbers, for example. Local authorities would then decide that, as they had local flexibility, they would not spend the money on teacher numbers. The parliamentary party colleagues of those who had decided not to increase teacher numbers in specific areas would then attack the Scottish Government for failing to deliver on its manifesto commitment to increase teacher numbers. The Scottish ministers obviously thought, “We’re damned if we do and damned if we don’t.”

How do we balance that? The Scottish ministers do not want to be in the position of providing additional funding for specific areas of manifesto commitment policy yet being criticised for not delivering it. On the other hand, if they do not provide local authorities with flexibility, they will be criticised for that. Is there a way in which that can be balanced?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2022-23: Public Finances and the Impact of Covid-19

Meeting date: 14 September 2021

The Convener

How can the Scottish Government fully fund local government, for example, if it is not fully funded through the block grant?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2022-23: Public Finances and the Impact of Covid-19

Meeting date: 14 September 2021

The Convener

Name them.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2022-23: Public Finances and the Impact of Covid-19

Meeting date: 14 September 2021

The Convener

That is helpful.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2022-23: Public Finances and the Impact of Covid-19

Meeting date: 14 September 2021

The Convener

It is an interesting example, but it is also geographically specific. It would not affect Edinburgh, for example.